The Prelate of the Methodist Church of Nigeria, Dr. Sunday Makinde, shares his experiences with ’NONYE BEN-NWANKWO
When you were ordained Prelate of the Methodist Church of Nigeria in 2006, how did you feel?
Honestly, I was uncomfortable. I kept asking myself how I could possibly step into the shoes of my predecessor, who had been in that position for 22 years. How would I match Sunday Mbang’s achievements? Others were jubilating for me; I just went for a retreat. I was praying and fasting. I asked God to give me the strength to move on. There are so many challenges in leadership. That is why I will continue to defend President Goodluck Jonathan. It is not easy to lead. While some people will be encouraging you, others will aim at destroying you. Some will give you advice that will lead to your downfall. It is now left for you to pray and ask God to give you the wisdom of discernment.
Did you ever expect to find yourself in this position?
That is why God is God. You cannot know the future, the future is in God’s hands but you must work hard to secure your future. I never knew I would be where I am today.
Many people see you as their role model. Do you sometimes feel pressured to live up to their expectations?
I always try to be myself at all times. A religious leader is different from a secular leader. As a leader of the church, you draw your strength from God. You fast and pray and look up to God. You have to seek the face of God because it is very important in leadership. Problems will come, but you have to ask God for guidance.
If you were not encouraged to join the Christian ministry, would you have considered doing that?
I wouldn’t be what I am today if not for the encouragement os some ministers. If God wants to help you, He will not come down. But He will send helpers to you. That is why you ought to be very careful in your relationship with people. If the elders see some traits in you, they will know what you will become in life. I have young ones behind me and I also see some traits in them. I saw some traces in a young man that has been working with me. At our last conference, I nominated him to be a bishop. Maybe those who facilitated my coming into the ministry saw some traits in me. When my headmaster saw that I eventually became a bishop, he was very happy. He used to flog me a lot. He helped to mould me.
Did your parents approve your decision to become a clergyman?
They did. I told my father that I wanted to work in a college of education as a teacher, but he said no way. My grandmother was the first Christian convert in my family. She encouraged me so much. She was always praying and fasting. But some people tried to discourage me. They said I was lazy that I couldn’t study and that was why I decided to join the ministry. But I proved them wrong. I studied hard and went to the university. You just have to be focused. I didn’t join the ministry because of joblessness. I was a teacher. The salary I was earning was higher than what the church paid me. But I left it. This is a vocation.
Don’t you think some people are involved in the ministry just to make money?
That is very true. They go into it because they want to make quick money. Religion has been commercialised. The quickest way to make money now is to open a church. It is very bad. Whatever we get in our own church, we put it back in the society. When leprosy was destroying people, we established a settlement for them in Uzuakoli, Abia State. We have a home for motherless children in Uzuakoli too. We have a university of science and technology. We believe the government cannot do everything alone. I came into the ministry because I was called. It wasn’t easy.
How was the biennial conference that the Methodist Church hosted a few weeks ago?
The biennial conference was very peaceful, successful and spiritual. We took vital decisions that will impact on the church. At the same time, we looked at the state of the nation. We thank God that it was very successful. People came from different parts of the country. Everything went fine.
Did you discuss possible solutions to insecurity in the country?
Yes, we did. We advised the government to be firm and courageous, as well as to uncover the faceless people behind Boko Haram.
You have warned that the crisis in the North might lead to war, if not checked. Do you think Nigeria can afford another civil war?
The Nigeria Civil War started when there was mass killing of members of a particular tribe in the North. The leaders of Boko Haram have been giving conditions for peace. They say Western education is evil. They say they don’t want it. They say they want to Islamise Nigeria. They have told the President to get converted to Islam or resign. This is the first time somebody from the South-South is ruling this country. They have given an ultimatum to Southerners to leave the North or they will continue to massacre them. Are we not heading for war? This was how the Civil War started. Many Southerners have lost their lives and the sources of their income. Are we going to fold our arms? That is why we are calling for a sovereign national conference. We should all come together to discuss. We need to discuss how we will live together as a people without rancour.
How did you survive the Civil War?
I was in the college then and the Army was conscripting students. One of my friends said we should go and enlist since we were in our final year. He said we could fight and be promoted lieutenants very quickly. I agreed. We decided to leave as early as 5 am the next day to enlist in the Army. I slept off. I had a dream that night. I saw myself in the war front and somebody pointed a gun at me. I was shouting, ‘Don’t kill me o, don’t kill me o,’ when I woke up. The following morning, my friend came and I told him I had changed my mind. The dream prevented me from joining the Army. War is a bad thing. Although we survived the Civil War, if there should be a religious war, we won’t be able to survive it. That is why I am begging our leaders to find a way to resolve this crisis so that it doesn’t degenerate to war, which will completely destroy the unity of this country.
The Christian Association of Nigeria has said that Christians will rather pray than avenge the deaths of their brethren in the North. How long will they continue to pray while the killings and bombings persist?
Those people said they have jihad. There is what we have in the Christendom. It is called the crusade. God hasn’t created somebody that he cannot subdue or conquer. This is God’s war and He will help us. He will fight for us. Christianity is a religion of peace. We will not retaliate and we will tell our members not to retaliate. Let God fight for you. When God starts fighting for us, it will surprise everybody.
Do you think President Jonathan should convert to Islam or resign?
Why should anybody suggest that? I don’t even know the kind of dialogue they want to have with this people. There is no dialogue. We cannot sacrifice our religion. Definitely, we cannot Christianise Nigeria. Religion is voluntary. This is an incredible demand. Some people say Nigeria will divide in 2015, why should we divide? Even if we must divide, religion should not divide us. We should be able to sit down and discuss.
What do you think about corruption in Nigeria?
You are referring to cash corruption. What about moral corruption? Corruption cuts across the board. Injustice is corruption. When you tell lies, you are corrupt. When you falsify your age, you are corrupt. When you rape people, you are corrupt. We need to do something in Nigeria so that corruption will go. If we practise our religion, corruption will go. Islam is a peaceful religion and it doesn’t support corruption. Christianity is a peaceful religion and it says ‘thou shall not steal.’ Corruption is an abomination in the Bible and Koran. In traditional religion, if you are corrupt, you may not even live. The god of that religion will strike you. But we no longer practice our religion. We don’t love again. If there is love, you will not steal pensioners’ money. Some of the pensioners have died because some people stole their money. Where are those thieves? Government should have the courage to deal with such people. We celebrate corrupt people in this country. But God will deal with them. At 60 years, I am a senior citizen now. In advanced countries, once you are above 60, you start living a better life. But here in Nigeria the reverse is the case; once you are 60, your suffering begins. Your pension is not regular. Your gratuity is delayed. Let us all return to God, we have turned our back on Him. There will not be peace until we return to God.
You attended a university in the USA and you were a pastor in one of the churches there. Why did you return to Nigeria?
I was given a church to pastor in America. But I believe my ministry is not among white people. I was offered a scholarship to study there and come back to serve my people. If the missionaries left the comfort of their countries to come and serve us, why should I go there to enjoy? That is corruption. My ministry is within my people. I thank God that I came back. Wherever you go, home is always the best. If you don’t develop your country, nobody will develop it for you.
As a youth, did you live a normal life or were you immersed in religion?
Life is a stage. You have to play the adolescent age. I am not a saint. I exhibited adolescent traits. I played pranks on people. I was a radical. I was very stubborn. My mother used to starve me. One day, my father gave me 36 lashes of the cane because I whistled when I saw a big yam in another man’s farm. He dealt with me. It was in July. Fresh yam was just being harvested at the time. They reported me to my father and he didn’t want to listen to any explanation. He asked me why I had to go to another man’s farm to fetch firewood. He asked me why I didn’t restrict myself to our own farm. I will never forget that day. I didn’t steal the yam, I didn’t take the yam. I only whistled because the yam was very big, yet my father flogged me. I used to think he wasn’t my father because of this. My teachers used to deal with me, too. My father said I was a rascal and he handed me over to the missionaries. That was where they boiled me to soften me up. I lived with teachers and pastors. As for my mother, anytime I went after a masquerade, she wouldn’t give me food. She said a Christian wasn’t supposed to go after a masquerade. One thing I hated so much in my life was starvation. But I thank God that all this made me a better person.
Were your parents rich?
They were not rich, but they were contented. We had three meals in a day. We got new clothes to wear only during festive periods. I was in Class Three in secondary school when I wore my first shoe. My aunty bought that shoe for me. She is still alive and I don’t joke with her. But I had good training. We were not used to eating egg or rice. But we were strong and fresh. Things worked well then.
At what point did you meet your wife?
I met her when I was a teacher. I was moving to theological college. She was a convert. She was very prayerful and spiritual. You know that converts are very prayerful and stronger Christians than those of us who are born into the religion.
Did you see her and conclude that she would be your wife?
I knew she was going to be my wife. If some people require one day to succeed in a project, mine will take three weeks and after a struggle. If I get anything cheap, I don’t always value it.
Was it easy getting married to her?
It wasn’t easy at all. She was the first daughter of a chief imam. We had to fast and pray until God helped us.
How has it been so far?
It has been great. She has been more than supportive. Don’t take God for granted. We have passed through a lot of trouble. My life has been filled with struggle. God has been God. He brought manna from heaven and enemies became friends. I thank God for His hand in my life.
Have you ever regretted being a pastor?
Never! I have not. There may be tribulation and challenges, but God told us to be of good cheer. He is always there for you. When you see us as pastors, we do have challenges and pains. But the grace of God is always sufficient for us.
What will you like to be remembered for?
I want people to remember me for somebody who loved the unity and cohesion of Nigeria and the progress and comfort of humanity.